Color Theory Pod: A Podcast About Being Black, Brown, and Queer in Academia, and in Life 

By Robert P. Robinson, Makeba Lavan, & José Alfredo Menjivar

Introduction

Academia is often a hostile place for people of color. Historically, academia and academic institutions were not designed with students/people of color to succeed and thrive. Thus, marginalized, minoritized, disenfranchised, and dispossessed students/people of color have to do dual work. Moreover, they exist and navigate such spaces, programs and institutions not designed or intended for them, while also still producing the same–if not better–quality academic production as their white counterparts.

From Left to Right (Jose Alfredo, Makeba, and Robert)

While the #BlackLivesMatter movement the past few years has helped capture student voices on the streets and on campuses, podcasts have, more broadly, provided digital environments, platforms and opportunities for people of color to frame and narrate their own discourse about the sociopolitical and sociocultural dynamics of their existence. The need for a space that bridges student voice from these movements with the affordances of a podcast emerged. Enters: Color Theory Pod.

As Zeus Leonardo and Ronald K. Porter argue in their article “Pedagogy of Fear: Toward a Fanonian Theory of ‘Safety’ in Race Dialogue”(2010): there are “no safe space[s]” (p. 149) for students/people of color, and discourses of “safe spaces” actually protect the safety of white people, while simultaneously exacerbating the racialized experiences of students/people of color. These realities are intensified for women of color and queer-identified people of color who experience complex, interlocking systems of oppression. Recognizing this need, we created a podcast series as an effort to shape a sonic critical space for ourselves–and other students of color–to discuss issues that we experience in the academy, and in everyday life.

This article will chart our journeys while discussing the podcast’s origins, rationale, complications, and continued need for media spaces for queer students of color. We hope Color Theory Pod serves as a meaningful adjunct to the existing political conversations and literature on intersectionality.

Color Theory Pod: Origins

Initial Brainstorm

Color Theory Pod emerged from an initial conversation between Makeba, a doctoral candidate in the English program, and José Alfredo, a doctoral student in the Urban Education program, at a meeting they attended at The Graduate Center. During this conversation, they discussed ways that they, as teachers of color and graduate students of color, relieved stress and engaged in self-care. The conversation then naturally shifted to their favorite podcasts: why they loved the ones they loved, why they stopped loving particular ones, and what podcasts they still wish existed.

Makeba and José Alfredo began to share their graduate school experiences, finding interesting yet disheartening commonalities across their programs and disciplines. They expressed how a podcast similar to their favorite podcasts but aimed towards graduate students of color could have greatly aided in their individual experiences and better shaped their academic trajectories. More and more, Makeba and José Alfredo realized that they both desired the same thing: a space for themselves, and other students of color, to discuss issues they face in the academy and everyday life. They agreed that a podcast would be the perfect platform because they generally maintain a casual vibe and are also portable, allowing the reader to pick, pause and listen while at home or in transit and on the go. As fourth year doctoral students in their respective programs, it was something that they felt they could now take on.

Color Theory Pod formed through a close network of proximities and six degrees of separation: Robert and José Alfredo were introduced to one another by a faculty member, as they are both doctoral students in the same program. Makeba and Robert met through the introductory course they shared in the Interactive Technology and Pedagogy (ITP) program at the Graduate Center. Makeba and José Alfredo met through a teaching fellowship they both accepted earlier that year. Although José Alfredo initially approached Robert with the idea to join Color Theory Pod, he declined because of existing projects and coursework. However, when Makeba suggested that the podcast could also serve as the collaborative project they had already due for the ITP program requisite, Robert agreed. Thus, Color Theory Pod was born.

The Project Switch

Originally, Makeba and Robert had envisioned an entirely different project for the ITP program. The proposed work was a repository of archival documents and articles that linked key events in the Black liberation history with speculative fiction from reconstruction onward. However, once the podcast moved toward the planning stages with two of the three podcasters, we all decided that it would make more sense to make the podcast our ITP independent study project. We were particularly intrigued once we were told that we would be the first to do so for ITP. The team began this podcast with several goals in mind. Mostly, we definitely wanted to–and still want to–create an archive of useful information for graduate students who are of color and/or members of the LGBTQIA+ community. Additionally, we sought a space to work through our experiences while giving our friends and people we admire a platform to speak about their experiences and expertise within/outside of the academy. None of us had any experience with podcasts before, so we had a steep learning curve regarding the process; nevertheless, we had a passion for our respective communities and a desire to provide a coping mechanism for graduate students of color.

Doing Our Homework: Context, Theory and Podcast Background

The Need

Within the broader context of graduate student realities, stress is a significant factor. One 1990’s study estimated that as many as ten percent of students in higher education need some sort of professional aid with stress management (Abouserie, 1994). A 2008 critical assessment of stress studies among higher education students revealed that much of the mental health struggles across university student levels were tied to degrees of self esteem; moreover, students who reported stronger mental health had higher correlations of self esteem (Robotham, 2008). Today, approximately one third of PhD students suffer from some common form of mental health malady, mainly depression. These rates were significantly greater than those already employed in academia or industry or other student groups within the higher education pool (Levecque et al, 2017).

What does this mean for PhD students of color? In the past 20 years, the number of Black and Brown PhD students has increased, which appears to be a promising shift in the academy. The concern, however, lies in the fact that nearly 80% of PhD completions are among white students (Lundy-Wagner, Vultaggio, & Gasman, 2013). At our home institution, The Graduate Center of the City University of New York, students of color make up less than a third of the doctoral enrollment (GC Office of Institutional Research and Effectiveness, 2014). If 32% of the general doctoral student population suffers from mental health, imagine how these factors are exacerbated for women and minoritized students. Campus climate is a major contributing factor to success for students of color, especially for women of color (Aryan & Guzman, 2010). A sense of belonging remains a key element within college persistence data, and one recent poll highlights that queer students of color were twice as likely as white heterosexual students to report that they did not feel a sense of belonging on their campuses (Bhattar & Shephard, 2017). Our podcast serves as an attempt to disrupt this stressful dynamic with a platform that resonates with the celebrations and struggles of students of color, of queer students, and of queer students of color who aspire to diversify the professoriate and critique the systems, subsystems, and practices that maintain the status quo.

Theoretical Influence

As graduate scholars, we have engaged with a number of theories and theorists who have shaped our reflections on daily interactions and current issues. First, we consider Kimberlé Crenshaw’s and Patricia Hill Collins’ conversations about intersectionality as a means of interrogating the specific experiences of women of color (Collins, 2015; Crenshaw, 1989; 1991), and we apply them to conversations of race, class, gender, and sexual orientation. Moreover, our focus on these demographics “highlights the need to account for multiple grounds of identity when considering how the social world is constructed” (Crenshaw, 1991, p. 1245). In other words, we look at intersectionality as the cross-section between different forms of oppression–and thus an intersectional framework requires us to advocate for liberation across these socially constructed lines (Collins, 2015; hooks, 1989). The three of us also have undergraduate training in English and literary theory. Borrowing from women of color scholars like bell hooks (1989), Angela Davis (2016), Audre Lorde (1984), Toni Morrison (2014), and many more, we seriously consider the power of voice. We question whose voices are at the forefront of academic discourse and whose voices are left out. The podcast, then, is a living breathing archive of our counternarratives–an amplification mechanism for students who are often silenced by the voice of predominantly white, upper-middle-class, heteropatriarchal power structures in the university.  As three queer educators and graduate scholars of color, we hope to speak to, with, and from our communities in hopes of creating an outlet that affirms the voices of students of color in the academy who are trying to reconcile their scholarly identity with those experiences related to their sociocultural positions.

Podcast Influences

While we were entirely new to the logistics of podcast production, we were by no means strangers to the podcast genre. Our individual approaches to Color Theory Pod were driven by our appreciation for our favorite podcasts. The three of us have a few podcasts that we really enjoy. Among them are The Read, The Friend Zone, Another Round and Last Name Basis. All of these podcasts were created by African Americans. Last Name Basis features an interracial couple, Franchesca and Patrick.  We love this podcast because it reminds us of the ways in which people are actively rejecting the basic tenets of this white supremacist society. In fact, this is consistent in each of the podcasts. Franchesca is a Black woman and Patrick is a white man, but they have been together for over ten years and they do not shy away from hard conversations about society. Instead, they do it with respect, love and humor. And while the three of us are academics, we are also friends. We wanted to provide a spirit of levity alongside our intellectual inquiry. Another Round features some of the best interviews we have ever heard. They bring in renowned guests and chat about the world in irreverent ways, usually over alcohol. The Read provides the most comic relief. Kid Fury and Crissle use the platform to make us laugh and answer all kinds of inappropriate questions. They do not shy away from the fire and brimstone often required to take a stand against injustice. Finally, we love The Friend Zone because of how genuine the hosts are. Fran gives awesome tips for self-care, which is so necessary in today’s world, despite one’s line of work. Similarly, the three hosts bring who we are and what we experience to our podcast in hopes that it can provide others with tips and a sense of camaraderie.

And Action: The Podcast Journey

Planning

Our initial planning conversations happened at The Graduate Center. Then one early Wednesday evening, the three of us met at a happy hour a few blocks away from school to buzzily (intentional spelling) draft episodes and outline the proposal. There are three of us involved in producing the podcast and we all bring our experiences and different areas of expertise to the show; our planning process reflected this balance. For the format, we decided to keep it relatively informal, with a few categories that we would attempt to address during most of the episodes. Our intention was to have consistent segments to speak to these categories. Roses and Thorns was our chance to share the struggles and successes of our day-to-day lives–not because we thought our lives were ridiculously interesting (though this might be up for debate). On the contrary, we were attempting to air elements of our lives we saw to be common among graduate students, more specifically graduate students of color. We hoped to build rapport with the audience through these consistent check-ins. Cultural Highlights provided a chance for us to respond to popular culture and politics. Mixing our reading lists, recent films, and the height of US political tensions, our first Cultural Highlights segment was the bulk of our first episode. Finally, Friends Corner, which we feature on episodes 2 and 4,  affords us the opportunity to interview people we admire and introduce our listeners to other points of view. In our most recent episode, we added two new segments. In Reading Rainbow we engage with the books on our respective reading lists, providing critical commentary, even as we praise the strengths. While the “Guilty Pleasures” segment sounds like a salacious slide into our DMs, it is actually a fun conversation about the lighter interests we are a little embarrassed to share in everyday conversation. We hope to extend all of these segments into future episodes.

In terms of finding a podcast platform, we had to negotiate between three different hosting sites. The initial proposal we sent to our advisor considered Stitcher. However, we uploaded the first episode through Podbean. Both are free audio platforms that offer limited data storage. In the end, we decided on SoundCloud because of its popularity. The name is most consistent with mainstream audiences, which would create an opportunity for greater traffic. Once the episodes were published on SoundCloud’s server, we were able to make the links readily available to graduate students, our primary audience.

Finding recording locations was also difficult. Soundproof rooms in The Graduate Center are reserved for the Audiology Program, and only special connections could grant us access. Luckily, we have a kind program administrative assistant who found us a quiet (but not soundproof) room. With regards to recording equipment, we met with members of the New Media Lab at the school to request use of the computers and digital recorders. We were granted access, but because of a miscommunication error, we were not able to procure recorders. Pressed for time, we attempted to use recorders from the library, but those were substandard quality. The Digital Fellows office also had a complete podcast recording equipment set, but when we contacted them to request use, we were told they were not ready to lend them to non-fellows just yet. In the end, we settled with our phones. The first three episodes use our phones solely; episodes 4 and 5 were recorded with our Mac laptops; and subsequent episodes will be recorded either through laptop, or with the recorders available through the Interactive Technology and Pedagogy Program at The Graduate Center.

The Episodes

Each episode took its own direction, but all of the content involved–and will continue to involve–discussions around national politics, film, television, Twitter/internet beef, books, and our everyday lives. In the first episode, we tell our journey to the podcast, discuss the election, celebrate Solange’s unapologetic Blackness, and critique neoliberalism and white liberal orthodoxy. We introduce Friends Corner in our second episode as we chart our respective journeys through academia over a friendsgiving at José Alfredo’s home. We also salute Asian men in television and Michael Ealy’s appearance on ABC’s drama Secrets and Lies. Episode 3 provides New Year’s advice for grad students; a trip down memory lane as we celebrate Fox’s Living Single; and a stance against remaking predominantly white films with all Black/Brown casts. Episode 3 also served as an unspoken homage to Meshell Ndegeocello, as she was the sole musician for all musical transitions between segments. In our fifth episode, we also use pop music related to important lines at the beginning or end of each segment. We celebrate and critique Baldwin, even as we explore the complications and affordances of graphic novels. In the “Cultural Highlights” conversation we question the irony of a predominantly white writing room for the OWN’ show Greenleaf–a show centered on Black church dynamics. In Episode 4, which will be released as a long lost episode, we discuss the women’s march after the inauguration, repeating the resounding chant of women of color who felt excluded from the march: “If it ain’t intersectional, it ain’t feminism.” This same episode also pushes against our usual sound formula, as we include a group recitation of the poem, “Fuck.”

Because Social Media Can Save Lives

Social media became an early ally in our developmental stages. Anxious to get a podcast name off the ground we presented the name BBQ–Black, Brown, and Queer in Academia–to our advisor in our first meeting. Robert suggested it as a placeholder until we took off, but all three of us knew it did not fit. At a meeting with the New Media Lab at the Graduate Center-–our opportunity to make a plea for a room and equipment use–he employed the name again. Shortly after our proposal was written, however, José Alfredo took to Facebook to gather input. One person posted the name, “Color Theory,” the trio unanimously confirmed, and the rest was history.

Facebook proved beneficial beyond our name, too. When we began to chart future content and episode recording dates, José Alfredo agreed to handle the social media maintenance. After creating an Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook, he uploaded photos of our recording dates and episode availability. Before we edited the first episode, he sent the raw cuts to our our mutual friends and welcomed feedback. The feedback assisted us in the initial editing stages and helped to strengthen our approaches to future recordings. The online presence created opportunities for us to connect to our communities. We shared episodes with professors who worked with undergraduate students of color, non-profit organizers, colleagues in our Urban Education and English programs as well as graduate students at NYU, Columbia, schools outside of the city. Color Theory Pod has been more than just a podcast about experiences; it has also been a way for us to connect to communities, refine our political ideologies, and spring into powerful conversations offline.

Feedback

After our rough cut email to friends, we received useful feedback. Colleagues celebrated the humor as we referred to the then president elect as Voldemort. One listener in particular raved that Makeba was a natural and that our rapport was fluid–easy. Another said José Alfredo had such a clear articulation of his political positions. And still another resonated with a comment about whiteness as a de-culturalizing project that often sends wealthier white folks on journeys abroad to find themselves. Subsequent episodes drew a new set of followers with listeners sharing how Makeba’s “That’s not a part of my ministry” had them in tears.

In terms of constructive feedback, we received commentary about the distraction of chewing on episode one (though the snacks were delicious). Another listener commented on the sound quality, and a few listeners shared how the cultural highlights segment in the first episode went a little long. A faculty member made similar comments about the sound quality and the length of the episodes as a whole. In response to the segment length, we recorded each segment separately, which made it easier to remove dead space, bloopers, and other transitions in subsequent episodes. In terms of overall episode length, we eventually agreed that we would allow the natural conversations to occur without too much attention to time in each recording–a style that is consistent with some of our favorite podcasts. In episodes 3 and 4, we were strategic with our phone placement in order to enhance the sound quality. We also used a Macbook Pro to record episodes 4 and 5, which helped with the stereo quality.

Challenges

One of the biggest challenges has been finding mutual time for all three members to record on a regular basis. We are all at very important junctures in our academic careers. Makeba’s dissertation prospectus was very recently approved, and she is currently writing the first draft of her dissertation. In addition, she teaches two courses, alongside the demands of her current fellowship, and it becomes quite difficult to manage a dependable recording schedule. In addition to second year coursework, Robert co-coordinates and mentors for the CUNY Pipeline Program, serves as a peer counselor in the International House, and works in an induction mentorship program for preservice and first-year teachers. Like Makeba, Jose Alfredo is also navigating the laborious demands of his current fellowship and teaching a course load, working on the literature review of his second doctoral exam, in addition to conducting clinical observations of preservice and first-year teachers, and organizing and facilitating teacher study groups with the New York Collective of Radical educators. Robert and José Alfredo also served as co-editors for a #BlackLivesMatter issue in the journal Theory, Research, and Action in Urban Education. Because of all of our commitments, the act of creating a recording schedule proved to be a logistical nightmare.

Editing has also been difficult to navigate. Right now, Robert is the only editor. Because each episode is just over an hour, editing takes a significant amount of time. For every hour recorded, at least five hours are required for the first round of edits. He sends this rough copy to the team; the team offers suggestions; and then he spends another 2 to 3 hours to finalize each episode. This summer, our goal is to become better at editing, so that we can distribute the time and energy across all three hosts. In the fall, we will apply for additional funding from The Graduate Center to hopefully hire an editor to finalize the subsequent episodes.

Conclusion: Stay Woke

Overall, we think the podcast is a great tool that gives voice to graduate students from various economic and cultural backgrounds and who bring their experiences from important rich struggles. As we saw with episode two’s Friendsgiving guests, these personal narratives will vary. We all experience struggles across the board on the basis of race, class, gender and sexuality, but how we engage with the graduate experience differs according to our specific circumstances and personalities. We hope to provide something that speaks to every graduate student, particularly students of color, through our topics, guests, and reflections. As first generation graduate students, our goal is to use the podcast as a digital affinity space, teaching vehicle, and constructively critical space for those most frequently in the margins of academia.

We agree that the most rewarding experience of Color Theory Pod is that it grew organically and effortlessly with the right individuals. As people of color we are imbued with double and sometimes triple responsibility. In our own work, we have to be above reproach in order for doors to be open to us. Then, we must always (those of us who give a damn, anyway) think about the ways in which we can help open doors and windows for others like us. Finally, we have do deal with those who think we will never belong and make it difficult for us at every turn.

Unfortunately, we get this from both inside and outside of our own communities. It should be noted that white supremacy does not need white people in order for it to maintain itself. In fact, white supremacy needs people of color to uphold its values. There are people of color who protect their seat at the table (of whiteness, power and privilege) by yanking the chair from underneath anyone else who looks like them. The Color Theory Pod crew is not only against this, but we are also committed to calling it out and taking a stand when we see it happening. We refuse to be silenced or intimidated. In this way, we hope to share techniques for and with others who deal with the same white-supremacist struggles in academia. We live in very hostile, thought-phobic times. The Color Theory crew wants to use our voices in order to help reconstruct the table. We refuse to take comfort in gaining a few chairs.

References

Abouserie, R. (1994). Sources and Levels of Stress in Relation to Locus of Control and Self Esteem in University Students. Educational Psychology, 14(3), 323–330.